[09:08:38] Hi guys. We've been using mediawiki to power https://wiki.mudlet.org a decade now and we've very happy users. That said, in our daily life as developers we've been using more and more markdown - on github and other platforms, and at this point the mediawiki syntax is the alien in the room and uncomfortable to work with. What are some suggestions [09:08:38] you guys have for easing this problem? [09:18:51] Not much [09:18:59] There are things like https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Markdown, but they're not maintained [12:36:35] Right, that is a pity. [12:42:40] Vadi2: have you tried using the VisualEditor? Ideally it hides most of the MediaWiki syntax away [12:43:19] This one? https://imgur.com/a/Gegvj3K [12:43:57] !e VisualEditor [12:43:57] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:VisualEditor [12:44:16] The screenshot you linked is, confusingly, called WikiEditor [12:47:29] We tried it back in 2017... [12:47:35] Results were - [12:47:37] Yes, I was attempting to get MediaWiki VisualEditor to work [12:47:37] but it requires Parsoid, which runs on a fairly bloated NodeJS setup [12:47:38] The node service exhausts our available memory and then MySQL (MariaDB) crashes quietly. [12:47:38] soooo [12:47:39] just gonna undo the installation so far and put the old editor back. [12:47:44] Has it changed since? [12:48:51] Vadi2: starting with MW 1.35, Parsoid is implemented in PHP and doesn't require a separate service [12:49:12] Just enabling the VE extension should just work for most cases [12:49:24] Nice! Good change. I will give it a go. [12:54:58] Mmm how do I actually turn it on? The documentation is difficult to read because of all of the "before 1.35, ..." prompts so in the end it is difficult to understand the exact steps for 1.35 [12:57:33] wfLoadExtension('VisualEditor') [13:04:24] Works. Thank you! [13:05:19] Great :D [18:23:35] Hi [18:23:51] Is it possible to create a page with an underscore in it? [18:24:43] I wanted to make page called "mod_gnutls-0.12 is released". But MW removed the underscore [18:26:29] Mediawiki will [18:26:39] _ is transformed to a space [18:36:26] btw is that the only transformation wikimedia makes to page names for urls? [19:03:37] "I wanted to make page called "..." <- You can use DISPLAYTITLE to change how it appears [19:04:03] Aha thanks [19:04:04] "btw is that the only transformat..." <- The first character will also be made uppercase unless you disable that. [19:08:20] legoktm[m]: thank you. WAs wondering because I was writing a program that deals with the .xml file (from the dumps) directly. Is that the extent of changes? [19:13:05] I believe so yes [19:13:17] You can also just use the API to normalize page titles [19:14:09] Ex: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&titles=Taylor_Swift [19:25:03] legoktm[m]: I'm not going to use hte API to check 6 million page titles [19:51:05] "legoktm: I'm not going to use..." <- Fair, wasn't sure what you were going to use the titles for, e.g. if you were making edits based on the dumps it would be an option. [19:54:57] When using automatic import of pictures from Commons, is it possible to make my MW cache the picture locally? [19:56:00] I thought instantcommons does that? [19:56:03] For example https://wiki.tnonline.net/w/File:Illustration_of_a_magnetic_cryptography_machine_from_%E2%80%9C_Magnes_sive_de_arte_magnetica%E2%80%9D.jpg [19:56:16] >InstantCommons-enabled wikis cache Commons content so that it is only downloaded once, and subsequent pageviews load the locally existing copy. [19:56:41] It seems to not do that. But maybe it's because I'm on the phone [19:57:33] The urls for the thumbs do point to upload.wm.o [19:58:16] Isn't that wrong then? [19:59:11] Ah [19:59:12] !bug T235551 [19:59:12] https://phabricator.wikimedia.org [19:59:13] T235551: InstantCommons should cache remote images - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T235551 [19:59:23] Or is that just beta? [19:59:41] Yeah, looks like it has been disabled at some point [20:00:27] I didn't notice this before, so maybe something changed in the 1.36 release [20:00:42] Since 1.27.2 basically [20:01:59] You can re-enable it on your wiki fairly easily, if you wanted [20:03:15] >* $wgUseInstantCommons now hotlinks Commons images by default instead of downloading originals and thumbnailing them locally. This allows wikis to save on CPU and bandwidth while reducing time to first byte for pages, even without a thumbnail handler. See $wgForeignFileRepos documentation for tweaks. [20:04:34] Looks like a license issue in the end? [20:05:24] Reedy: I'd like that. Mostly performance reasons but also to not have to send traffic elsewhere [20:05:39] there is a question/statement about licenses, but honestly the bug that disabled the cache is not related at all to that. T145496 [20:05:40] T145496: beta cluster: Warning: failed to mkdir "/srv/mediawiki/php-master/images/thumb/... - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T145496 [20:06:04] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/InstantCommons#Rationale does talk about the licensing issues [20:06:39] ^ though that page reads more like an RFC than anything [20:06:52] * Reedy removes the mention of cache as it's obviously misleading [20:09:49] Using remote thumbails by default makes InstantCommons work on more wikis since you don't need imagemagick, etc. all configured. Especially on hosts that don't allow shelling out, and so on [20:10:06] Well even without instant commons people can downloadibg files assuming the license is correct. What's the real difference here? [20:10:46] They can download and mis-attribute/license the files if they really want [20:10:58] Nothing to stop them, beyond the potential threat of legal action from someone [20:11:00] legoktm: indeed. Didn't say it is bad. It is useful as some wikis are also limited in bw etc. [20:11:11] Both options has their place imho [20:11:35] But in this case, isn't it being loaded client side from the remote wiki? So it's not really about the wikis bandwidth? [20:11:48] the remote wiki, in this case, being commons? [20:12:18] Agreed [20:13:18] Reedy: It's not what I meant. If the file says CC-BY-4.0, I would assume I can copy it and attribute the author. If it lates shows to be wrong, what can I do? [20:13:30] Fix/update it? :) [20:13:54] As long as you reference/cite where you got it from in the first place (audit trail etc) [20:14:07] With remote wiki I just meant small personal wikis hosting on small providers. Hot linking off commons saves them bandwidth [20:14:58] With instant commons it's the same. It just helps me copy the file including description, author and license [20:23:42] Hi, does anyone know how to edit sidebar for mobile devices? [20:24:42] Reedy: https://m.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgForeignFileRepos this one? Do I have to disable instant commons first? [20:25:04] Kizule, can you be a bit more specific about what you're trying to do? [20:25:29] AntiComposite: This task is related. https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T65459 [20:25:35] I want to add some links in the mobile menu. [20:25:45] Forza: Basically, yeah. Disable InstantCommons, copy the "old" version of the config from https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/c/mediawiki/core/+/336674/1/includes/Setup.php and paste that in your LocalSettings, without the if ( $wgInstantCommons ) {} [20:26:08] And... I want to know is it possible on some way, and if yes, what would be cool.. How? :) [20:26:22] >Great idea, mw.util.addPortletLink can be used customize this menu. [20:26:46] I imagine is probably the only way currently.. Without hacking the core files [20:26:57] Reedy: thanks [20:27:31] Previous two messages were for me, or for Forza? :thinking_face: [20:27:46] the ones answering your question were for you [20:28:53] Okay, thanks. [20:29:28] but yes, if you're trying to add links, mw.util.addPortletLink should work fine. https://doc.wikimedia.org/mediawiki-core/REL1_36/js/#!/api/mw.util-method-addPortletLink [20:30:57] :thumbsup: [20:31:03] (y)