[00:07:48] The first one doesn't have an account on loginwiki [00:08:24] That's odd; @Site Reliability Engineers should look into that [00:09:42] It thought login wiki accounts are made like any other wiki on view [00:09:57] no [00:10:02] although now you mention it all the vandal account ives seen only have login and meta attached [00:10:02] login should attach automatically and promptly [00:10:03] they are made automatically on sign up [00:10:15] however it's been rough lately and I've seen a delayed connection happen often [00:11:02] on occasion centralauth for a new account also doesn't quite behave but then, centralauth being buggy and falling apart is both known and unfortunately expected to worsen until a wider update to the software can happen [00:11:11] ie mediawiki 1.42/3 [00:12:18] Considering impending doom [02:47:33] [1/3] Hi, I would like to report an active vandalism on a wiki! [02:47:33] [2/3] https://monstergirlencyclopedia.miraheze.org/wiki/Monster_Girl_Encyclopedia [02:47:34] [3/3] A user goes by Soyjak.party is change almost every pages on the wiki with gore pictures [02:47:59] The admin of said wiki is currently offline and no way we can ban the troll [02:48:36] @alexdoheny canyou please @CVT on Discord? [02:49:06] Sure, hold on. [02:49:07] @CVT [02:50:08] Thanks. If no one shows up for a bit and it gets worse ping Stewards as well but I don't want to ping them if Labster or Raidarr are online to blcok and lock if needed [02:50:20] In the mean time try to revert [02:51:04] Locked + CUing [02:51:24] Many thanks ! [02:52:05] Thanks @kiju1108! [02:52:16] @kiju1108 see DMs [02:53:19] [1/2] We have members on the wiki doing their best reverting the edits now [02:53:19] [2/2] I think we will need a roll back for such scale of vandalism [02:54:27] there should be a local rollbacking right [02:54:38] I’m happy to deal with some of it as a GR but I’m mobile currently so it’ll have to wait for a bit [02:55:45] Isn't there a js snippet to allow rollback on mobile? [02:56:02] I'm wondering if Twinkle rollback works in global.js [02:58:18] [1/2] Need to ask the admin of wiki about it, unfortunately he's not here so gotta wait. [02:58:18] [2/2] Would be really grateful if you can help with the rollback 🙇‍♂️ [02:58:33] Will do, though it’ll be a minute [02:59:16] No worries, thank you so much! [02:59:29] Thank you for handling the vandalism! @alexdoheny [03:00:47] I'm about to eat dinner and sleep but if you folks need it I may be able to assist in reverting. Unlike Brandon I don't have global rollback though [03:02:02] Soon enough, Pix, soon enough 🙂 [03:02:20] MacFan4000: did we ever get that relay set up for #volunteering? [03:02:51] It's not registered on my side [03:03:08] just sre, cvt, op, tech [03:03:25] plus offtopic and general [03:04:43] come on, why gore!!! [03:05:15] day ruined [03:07:55] Also @brandon.wm I had something(not urgent) to talk to you about but my phone's dead so Discords out and I have a feeling I may forget by tommorow afternoon. So if I do forget feel free to bump me :) [03:08:52] Yep no worries [05:49:07] [1/2] > soyjak.party [05:49:07] [2/2] [05:50:10] [1/3] also um wow I think it might be a good idea to get someone to revdel some of these edits [05:50:10] [2/3] https://monstergirlencyclopedia.miraheze.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Soyjak.party [05:50:10] [3/3] really disturbing photos, also it's page-breaking HTML vandalism [06:11:27] i'm guessing those images are from wikimedia commons rather than uploaded locally... [06:23:21] yes [06:23:25] genuine medical images [06:23:26] but gory [06:24:17] yeah probably would be best to revdel those [06:47:50] @CVT [06:48:04] We can delete the edits using them and the page breaking html [06:48:12] Well someone in CVT can [06:48:26] You can turn off instant commons if you wish too [06:49:01] I can revdel [06:58:12] Ty @reception123 [09:25:32] [1/2] @reception123 Thank you so much for your help 🙇‍♂️ [09:25:32] [2/2] And thank you all for stopping the vandalism today! [14:34:20] https://qsmpwiki.miraheze.org/wiki/Talk:Born_in_Chaos - page created by an IP that translates to "titty titty" [19:05:13] Also revdel the ones with edit summaries because the links in the edit summaries are to a website that has 1) gay porn and 2) JS that spams annoying noises and opens a bunch of popup windows [19:10:06] [1/2] Also [19:10:06] [2/2] https://monstergirlencyclopedia.miraheze.org/wiki/HELP_SOMEONE_IS_MESSING_WITH_ALL_THE_PAGES_IDK_WHAT_TO_DO_BUT_SEND_THIS_OUT! [19:10:25] is- is this vandalism or a call for helo [19:23:16] i think the latter [19:23:30] h u h [19:27:03] @CVT [19:27:17] _sighs_ [19:28:12] GRs need the ability to delete pages [19:28:17] I’m of no use here [19:28:42] Humor aside, that shouldn't even be on professional pages. [19:28:42] @brandon.wm clue is in the name mate [19:30:20] If we're going to do that, then GR needs to be renamed to "Vandal Patrol" or similar [19:30:35] Very misguided request for help [19:31:16] Global Patroller cuz why not [19:31:30] Patrollers cant delete [19:31:41] That's part of the delta between GR and GS, full-delete privileges globally is a much bigger level of trust. [19:32:02] If we need to make an intermediate mid-trust role like... I dunno, turbo-janitor, sure, we can consider that. [19:32:04] there was a suggestion to give GR block [19:32:11] Also no [19:32:16] local block might not be a bad idea [19:32:24] Global ROLLBACKER [19:32:28] Clue in the name [19:32:29] Something like that could be useful [19:32:39] Or reform GS into that [19:32:43] Local block on every wiki might as well be GS [19:32:44] *GR [19:32:50] Sounds a little outlandish. Global Rollbacker is a fine name and it's fine just the way it is. [19:32:57] Yeah, expanding GR really does seem like scope creep [19:33:07] The point is an after-the-fact cleanup crew, not a first responder [19:33:09] mm nah :/ [19:33:33] Hmm yeah fair [19:33:35] Scope creep is one phrase for it [19:33:45] We’re expanding GS as is [19:34:03] Scope creep? Sounds like something you would hear in a Ghostbusters movie. [19:34:06] Why couldn’t we make GS whatever the new RfC says it is and then create a GS role [19:34:23] solely-CVT but a first responder [19:34:34] "Global Moderators" would be a good name for the replacement role [19:34:40] something like that yeah [19:34:42] if wanted [19:34:44] Janny [19:35:08] Sounds like something that should be of its own entity: Being a separate thing. [19:35:43] <.labster> Mods, mods! [19:35:49] janny [19:36:17] <.labster> (short for Janissary, obviously) [19:36:25] I just think we need to evaluate how roles are useful [19:36:51] We talk about minimizing and removing redundancies (hence rollbackers and patrollers combined on Meta), but GR isn’t quite useful [19:37:20] It's a stepping stone with very little worth [19:38:04] yes [19:38:28] @brandon.wm then maybe we scrap GR [19:38:36] Adding random rights to it isn't the way to go [19:38:49] <.labster> I really don't see the trust needed for delete as a higher level than edit warring [19:39:29] <.labster> What if we rename GR to Edit Warrior? [19:39:37] Labster moment [19:39:49] <.labster> Yes I was inspired. [19:39:51] @.labster if it's still around next April [19:40:24] next april gonna be interesting [19:40:38] [1/2] GR is a very low-trust role in my view, as reversions can be easily reverted. Limited chaos to be caused in malicious hands. [19:40:38] [2/2] Global delete though, I could think of a whole lotta ways to mis-use in annoying capacities. [19:41:05] <.labster> Local sysops/crats will notice weird deletes and undo them the same as for edits. [19:41:40] Yep, but that could cause a lot more crashy/break-stuff problems in short term. With GR you'll be much harder pressed to nuke core template/module infrastructure [19:41:59] Local staff having to revert actions by global MH right holders is a huge blow to our iamge imo [19:42:17] <.labster> So don't give anyone GR then. [19:42:31] Yo no comprendo [19:42:59] <.labster> Reverting staff action is reverting staff action, whether it's a delete or a rollback. [19:43:06] Creating an inbetween role between GR and GS (soon to be amended) would be the best solution; requires a little more trust than GR, but not nearly as much as GS [19:43:27] I don’t mind that [19:43:41] I just think that there’s really no use for GR [19:43:49] In theory, it’s a good idea, but practically, there’s no use [19:43:51] Then the jump becomes user -> GS [19:43:56] Unless you count WC [19:43:57] GS in that RfC essentially becomes baby steward with no NDA requirement [19:44:00] As has been said, it’s a glorified edit war user right. [19:44:03] Which is probably a good thing [19:44:08] but thats a jump both up and to the side [19:44:19] Oh I don't disagree [19:44:39] I don't see the harm in it existing imo [19:44:44] Yeah, you can revert mass vandalism, but then the vandal reverts your revert? [19:44:51] Yes [19:44:52] It’s just a mess and doesn’t really make sense [19:45:04] GR isn't a first response tool [19:45:07] can help clean up bout it [19:45:16] <.labster> People tend to think about global roles from the standpoint of what rights should be included, but we really should be thinking about it from the other way around: what kinds of things should be accomplished. Global moderator is a good idea, global baby steward is a good idea. Global Edit Warrior doesn't seem like a good job? [19:45:19] It feels like a stepping stone to either GS or Steward, but there’s really no skills developed in GR [19:45:24] Hence it cannot be a stepping stone [19:45:43] Yeah but that's still better than manually reverting the vandalism, there isn't always someone available for blocking [19:45:55] It's at least a little stool to show you have basic ability to use rights correctly [19:45:59] Also it's good for cleanup [19:46:06] I mean, it’s one button instead of two [19:46:11] lemme open up ms paint rq [19:46:14] I'd actually be in favor of GR becoming a deputized/appointed position [19:46:40] Global Rollback should be scrapped [19:46:41] <.labster> It's a stepping stone insofar as we don't see you abuse anything. Let's say there's some new user, let's call them Jia Tan, who wants to be involved. Then Jia is GR for a while, before promoting to GS. Since they didn't do anything bad as GR, we know Jia Tan is trustworthy. [19:46:50] Something else could replace what GS is now [19:46:57] E.g. round up trusted users to take expedient care of a specific, limited-time event [19:47:00] Current GS is becoming baby / trainee steward [19:47:03] I think internal CVT policies to handle could be a good idea - say GS/steward handles and locks the vandal, and then pings GR to clean up the mess [19:47:05] It's faster than editing an old revision or pressing the undo button, especially for a large amount of vandalism. One button instead of two can actually be very meaningful for mass vandalism, especially if you have a bad Internet connection [19:47:05] Steward says same [19:47:38] This then maybe, and Stewards appoint GRs as needed/requested [19:47:53] In my experience editing an old revision or saving an undo can take 15-30s which can be significant for vandalism [19:47:58] That’s fair I suppose, but “no abuse” is a lower bar [19:48:31] Jia Tan is the xz backdoor person lol [19:48:48] <.labster> Yeah, Brandon missed the subtext [19:48:57] <.labster> Trust is hard. [19:49:27] _presents a few of our users as case studies_ [19:49:39] One is even linked in the RfC for GS [19:49:42] [1/2] GR today is essentially a graffiti cleanup crew, based on stated purpose. [19:49:42] [2/2] It has a use, but service as an induction point to other roles is limited. [19:49:45] I think it being a “trust” role is fine, but there needs to be a bit more structure around it and not just what it is now [19:49:46] Disruption as a GS or GR is a lot more noticeable than a malicious git maintainer though [19:50:05] <.labster> You trust me, but you've never seen a picture of me. What if it turns out that I am the walrus? [19:50:24] [1/3] I missed a bit but to illustrate a long passed point: [19:50:25] [2/3] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/443926951292567562/1229519214327500850/FbdPXSJ.png?ex=662ffa00&is=661d8500&hm=dd0437d6f81cb9898f6653383a0080ebbf7bdd43d19e1755f21fcedf6c931f16& [19:50:25] [3/3] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/443926951292567562/1229519214977613926/GT8Auro.png?ex=662ffa00&is=661d8500&hm=01340bd24edeedfed6cf2bfa459b635617104714d1b436570756816093eb6148& [19:50:32] I like the points being raised here though, will be thinking about this further. [19:50:43] I'll leave my Ko-Fi in my bio donations open [19:50:56] <.labster> Pix for GIA!!!1! [19:50:56] There's also more paths if you count tech [19:51:27] Tech & community roles are very different [19:51:37] Yeah [19:51:48] No offence to them but half the developers I meet shouldn't be let anywhere near a community role [19:51:59] Someone did a neat lil' visio diagram of our progression paths the other day with some proposals. Might have been Labster? [19:52:10] <.labster> Yeah, I can share my idea [19:52:11] Was Labster I believe yeah [19:52:30] GIE also adds in a new element [19:52:37] curious what y’all think [19:52:42] is that a community or tech role? [19:52:45] hm, fair [19:52:49] it could be both…. [19:52:59] <.labster> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/443926951292567562/1229519865115705444/wiki-volunteer-org.drawio.png?ex=662ffa9b&is=661d859b&hm=783b597343ff2ef8c5ea3d7db6ff77638f4edaed89296fa2e98b13ec05d5bd2e& [19:53:04] GIE is a technical role id say [19:53:04] Still, it can't hurt by itself [19:53:09] Mine was prettier [19:53:11] <.labster> obviously names could be different [19:53:20] GIE shouldn't be making any decisions I don't think [19:53:25] Just helping users stuck [19:53:31] <.labster> But they build trust [19:53:32] I’m unsure about meta sysop to GIA [19:53:38] It's like a Line 1 / Line 2 support engineer [19:53:40] Maybe local IA to GIA [19:53:41] <.labster> Yeah it's lame, just ignore me [19:53:52] <.labster> But the idea of being multiple tracks to gain trust is still valid. [19:53:57] I very much like the idea though of WC not being entry level [19:54:10] And I definitely wouldn't let our line 1s out of their office. Have any of you watched the IT Crowd? [19:54:11] Gr should get cvtwiki access or be scrapped altogether [19:54:12] It’s quite a trusted role than say, GR and I would prefer we move away from that [19:54:40] cvtwiki is also an interesting idea for GRs to build trust [19:54:50] <.labster> Deciding the fate over an entire wiki is less undoable than deleting pages. [19:54:51] they can sometimes provide useful input on LTAs [19:54:56] I'd vote to scrap GR tbh [19:55:00]