[00:57:03] [1/2] It's not exactly that, but it's a reference to the literature that spawned the category. [00:57:04] [2/2] Same difference, in the end [02:20:37] I really wonder why people sign up with names like this 💀 [02:21:04] The person doesn't seem to be a troll, they made a harmless edit, but why do people think it's acceptable to make that their username on a public sfw website?? [02:54:32] I propose that offensive usernames get changed to DeletedUsername and a bunch of numbers [02:54:46] like DeletedUsername1234567890 [02:54:54] Could possibly work [02:54:58] or MirahezeUser [02:55:00] Yea [02:55:02] Miraheze1234567890 [02:55:41] is too harsh banning the use of miraheze just because their username [02:56:36] or just request a rename :AkaShrug: [02:57:04] nah [02:57:40] and if they log in with their old username they get logged in their new username [02:58:15] because of the thing that you get logged out after renaming [02:58:50] also suggest to the user to change their username if they don't like the bunch of number [03:00:15] If username is a personal attack, we are suppressing it [11:32:00] [1/2] actually stewards can suppress them [11:32:00] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/443926951292567562/1233742442793144431/image.png?ex=662e33b0&is=662ce230&hm=ed7aab7d2a545bbbc3bf4db3d23fa4560417f416f52efd6e74fbc4c9d74c277d& [15:23:17] Yep, pretty much reserved for turbo-offensiveness/PII [15:24:08] how does that work, curiously? when they make an edit, do they just not show up? [15:24:40] I'm not entirely sure, actually. [15:26:44] it'd be funny to test lol, that's [15:27:08] It'd be interesting to test ahah, something I'm now curious about :ThinkerMH: [15:54:23] try it on Silicona [15:57:04] how about..... [15:57:08] wait actually..... [15:58:27] @carhles that was a joke I promise 🙂 [15:58:37] I am not evil [15:58:54] LOL i know [15:59:23] That is publicly mark [15:59:34] i am insane thoug [15:59:42] "PixDeVl | Professional Evil Steward" [16:00:05] that was naughty [16:00:17] thats crazy [16:00:21] i mean... it's in the name... PixDeVil [16:00:30] That was the intention [16:00:34] I have two spellins [16:00:40] PixDeVl and pixlDeV [16:00:43] Pix Devil [16:01:01] I did make a joke of that with my april first nickname [16:01:05] it should be in audit log [16:01:16] from april 1? [16:01:20] yeah that's long lost [16:02:05] ja [16:02:13] nah it's 90 days right? [16:02:27] yeah but the amount of stuff that flows through the audit log..... [16:02:35] you can filter [16:02:41] actually I dunno if we log nickname changes [16:02:42] hang on [16:02:48] discord does [16:03:17] [1/2] tis here [16:03:17] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/443926951292567562/1233810712984293406/Screenshot_2024-04-27_at_9.03.12_AM.png?ex=662e7345&is=662d21c5&hm=74e8a897cf379fc173472688cb3d5560f09180ccf155b40eec990daa7e30b07b& [16:03:54] M H Couper [16:04:09] bonus points if you know who that is refering too [16:04:28] DB Cooper [16:04:34] that was my first thought lol [16:04:35] right? [16:04:37] yeah [16:05:54] https://tenor.com/view/pointing-that-is-correct-thats-right-good-job-way-to-go-gif-18723702 [16:05:59] also brandon [16:06:14] thoughts on https://issue-tracker.miraheze.org/T12075 ? [16:06:38] I'd +1 it [16:07:06] Reception came up with it yesterday and i made the pr just past midnight [16:07:58] it [16:08:06] it's a good idea yeah [16:08:27] i wanna practice dev and make my life eaiser win win [16:08:32] and everyone elses [17:07:14] Would a user be able to suppress usernames on his wiki? [17:09:03] Naughty 😄 [19:13:25] This sounds like a good idea [19:13:29] No need to do UP lock then [19:14:36] if someone honestly signed up with offensive server nick or username, that's grounds to kick out. its done intentionally to get a rise out of folks. [19:15:02] likelyhood of compliance to change is low [19:19:52] So for those that weren't in the chat yesterday [19:21:30] [1/2] I propose that users with offensive username get automatically (or preferably in like in 2 minutes idk) changed to MirahezeUser and a bunch of numbers, like this [19:21:30] [2/2] MirahezeUser4672829292 [19:21:57] Because locking users of using MH only for their username is kinda harsh [19:27:27] assume good faith [19:27:44] Perhaps they do not know the username shows up for other people, or didn't intend to post anywhere, etc. [19:32:29] on a usual basis, how many of such people listen to requests by server admins/mods to change? [19:32:58] no idea, never measured that, never seen that happen on discord, and we are not talking about discord [19:33:21] ok, what about on wiki? [19:33:42] because usually the response is a wiki admin issue a permanent ban and leaving a talk page message to try again [19:33:50] Yes [19:33:55] The response is usually not to ask them to change [19:34:13] I recall one case seeing Reception123 ask someone named something like "HornyLikeA14YearOldGirl" to change their username and that person did [19:34:37] Every other case I've seen was an immediate lock without asking them to change the usernaem [19:34:50] that would indicate these such users on wiki are typical disruption purposes [19:35:03] In what way does that indicate this? [19:35:10] ^ [19:35:13] Yes [19:35:21] How does this prove that those users would've been disruptive if they weren't locked? [19:36:03] whether or not the user would have done anything, the disruption is caused by the act of registering to get a rise out of folks ie trolling [19:37:03] the proof is those such users get locked almost immediately onsight [19:37:04] [1/2] > act of registering to get a rise out of folks ie trolling [19:37:04] [2/2] No, there is no evidence of this [19:37:10] How does that prove they are trolling? [19:37:27] They got locked, yes. That does not prove that they should have been locked. [19:37:55] [1/3] A bad username does not indicate trolling. Like I said: [19:37:56] [2/3] > Perhaps they do not know the username shows up for other people, or didn't intend to post anywhere, etc. [19:37:56] [3/3] You never rebutted this. You started talking about Discord servers instead. [19:38:19] I switched back on wiki related after you brought it up [19:38:36] Yes and your wiki-related messages just said "they got banned so it proves they should be banned" [19:39:02] You’re registering on a public website, chances are the username would appear somewhere… Ignorance does not mean a free pass [19:39:06] The reason users are currently locked for UP violations is because that is current policy, that does not prove the policy is good or that they are troll [19:39:09] Right [19:39:10] But AGF [19:39:15] It's one violation by a brand new user [19:39:24] Hence the proposal, make them change their username [19:39:41] here's the thing, even without the global policy; majority of wiki admins or discord server mods would instantly ban without a second thought [19:39:43] AGF is not a miraheze guideline or policy, really need get out of the habit of quoting English Wikipedia guidelines. [19:39:59] That does not mean it is a good idea [19:40:07] So we should assume bad faith of new contributors? [19:40:19] Yes, it's a Wikipedia policy, the reasoning behind it is still sound [19:40:29] common sense indicates such users are joining or registering for the explicit purpose of causing disruption for entertainment value [19:40:33] No I never said that either, I said your argument is based off a policy/guideline that doesn’t apply to Miraheze [19:40:39] Collei, this is not wikipedia [19:40:45] Common sense is not always correct [19:40:51] Nor do I think that this falls under common sense [19:40:51] I beg your pardon? [19:40:57] what? [19:41:02] When isn’t common sense isn’t correct… [19:41:03] Common sense is just what you inherently think feels correct. Sometimes you can be wrong. [19:41:09] Usually common sense is correct yes [19:41:23] But it is just your inherent feeling/bias/thought towards a situation, it can be wrong [19:41:47] Collei, can you name say 3 to 5 users who registered on a wiki with an offensive or inappropriate username that when asked to rename or register per username policy actually complied? [19:42:02] I would say not registering using a offensive username is pretty common sense [19:42:06] You asked this already [19:42:09] And I answered [19:42:17] [1/3] > The response is usually not to ask them to change [19:42:17] [2/3] > I recall one case seeing Reception123 ask someone named something like "HornyLikeA14YearOldGirl" to change their username and that person did [19:42:18] [3/3] > Every other case I've seen was an immediate lock without asking them to change the username [19:42:31] [1/2] yeah, i'm asking it in a different way [19:42:31] [2/2] that's 1 example. [19:42:45] I do not know any other case where someone was actually asked to change their username [19:43:23] on large well run wikis, anyone that registered an offensive/inappropriate username got banned and treated as potential troll [19:43:36] Plus you are acting like we are issuing indefinite never able to come back type bans, those users are very capable of contacting stewards to request a username change and a unlock [19:43:48] [1/10] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Foundation#Usage_of_English_Wikipedia_essays [19:43:48] [2/10] > Commonly, you will find users on Miraheze Meta who cite English Wikipedia (or, to a lesser extent, Wikimedia Meta-Wiki) essays to explain a point. These may include WP:AGF to encourage users to assume good faith, WP:BOLD to exhort users to be courageous and make changes that improve Miraheze or take action to help out others or the project, WP:SNOW to [19:43:48] [3/10] indicate that a proposal has little chance of passing, What is trolling? (Wikimedia Meta-Wiki) to explain what is a troll, just to name a few. [19:43:49] [4/10] > [19:43:49] [5/10] > Once more, as many of our users are also Wikimedia volunteers, they tend to carry over the tendency to cite these essays. Citing these essays is generally acceptable and can be useful to explain a viewpoint or the reasoning behind an action. Some English Wikipedia essays are also adopted as a de facto guide on good practices and may sometimes even be [19:43:49] [6/10] cited by Stewards or Meta Administrators as their basis for making a decision. [19:43:50] [7/10] > [19:43:50] [8/10] > While these essays serve great purpose, it is sometimes accidentally assumed that all English Wikipedia essays and policies apply as policy on Miraheze and Miraheze Meta. This is not true; Miraheze and Miraheze Meta have their own policies, located at Category:Global policies and Category:Policies respectively. Even though some English Wikipedia essay [19:43:50] [9/10] s and policies sometimes serve as an example of good practices, those essays are not policy. [19:43:51] [10/10] I am citing the Wikipedia policies as a way to cite the concept/idea behind them [19:44:19] this isn't pertaining to meta or any official miraheze wikis rather individual wikis where admins just issue a lock and moving on [19:44:25] They are only told "appeal to stewards[at]miraheze.org", not request a username change - and if they just signed up, they probably wouldn't feel like emailing just to fix their username [19:44:37] [1/2] 1. No, it is pertaining to Miraheze, you misinterpreted the discussion [19:44:37] [2/2] 2. How does a wiki issue a lock? [19:44:43] What someone does on their local wiki isn’t any of our control, so theres no argument to be made [19:44:54] Global locks, not wiki-specific blocks, are what are being discussed [19:45:04] Then they evidentially dont see a true need to use the service [19:45:28] Not everyone who signs up wants to send an email just to use the service [19:45:45] And what @emicraftnoob proposed is simpler than sending an email [19:45:51] Then don’t register using an offensive username, I mean this pretty common sense across the board [19:46:35] Again, I don't think everyone knows that their offensive username will be seen by others. On many websites actually, even public ones like Fandom, if you put in an offensive username and don't really do more than change your user settings and visit wikis, nobody will really notice or care [19:46:39] lol what [19:46:40] [1/3] > I propose that users with offensive username get automatically (or preferably in like in 2 minutes idk) changed to MirahezeUser and a bunch of numbers, like this [19:46:41] [2/3] discussion started on this point. wiki admins are not going to waste time to report to stewards, they block and move on. if stewards see then it gets locked [19:46:41] [3/3] I said admins, this refers to wiki admins.... [19:46:55] I also just said Ignorance does not mean you get a free pass [19:47:01] Admins are free to do whatever they want [19:47:13] what on earth are you arguing here? [19:47:23] this is no longer even coherent [19:47:26] for what Stewards should do when a report is made or they discover it themselves... [19:47:35] Nobody asked any wiki admins to do anything [19:47:39] Wiki admins were not mentioned by anyone other than you [19:47:41] At this point it doesn’t matter, this discussion isn’t going anywhere. So please switch topics and if its not within cvt purview switch channels. [19:47:53] Ok [21:57:26] :DoneMH: [22:04:24] [1/2] I propose to blacklist offensive things in usernames when registering [22:04:24] [2/2] No more bans I guess :ThinkerMH: [22:09:12] not likely feasible to prevent all cases of such [22:09:21] people are creative [22:09:35] what is happening [22:09:39] this is cvt [22:13:44] So let's add more things to blacklist [22:31:56] It was stated to drop this subject!! [22:32:15] Take it to #offtopic