[00:57:17] [1/2] https://youtube.com/shorts/b15unZ2tAhk?si=n9EK8sAl6Ci11Pcf [00:57:17] [2/2] I can speak discord. [00:59:56] fym w ts pmo [01:00:59] [1/3] For your mother? [01:01:00] [2/3] Who? [01:01:00] [3/3] The sister? [02:05:25] The father, the brother, and the holy Mirahezeian. [02:52:42] Ah, yeah it is just the image itself [02:55:39] Huh. [03:21:09] Brunch isn't real [03:21:17] It's either bread or crunch, you can't have both [05:52:35] bread crunch! [05:57:56] Crunch bread. 🍞 [08:49:38] I only need things for java and gradle, so I'll bear that in mind. Thanks! [12:15:47] What decor should I put on my profile next?: [15:06:43] I added a couple of bugs to https://github.com/Telepedia/TableProgressTracking in case anyone fancies taking a look! [15:15:25] i shall quash these beasts! [15:19:47] Yippee! 🥳 [15:24:21] [1/2] Interestingly I can't repro this blank line business, hmm [15:24:21] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486385256700444802/Screenshot_2026-03-25_at_15.24.06.png?ex=69c54fa4&is=69c3fe24&hm=a7a1a7e99a8bbd7bff564007993f31409b6bbbdc3817f836cb90186104d6892d& [15:26:07] Let me try again [15:26:11] oh this skin is nicceeee though [15:27:16] Thank u! Let me get a sandbox set up with a table [15:27:47] I can repro it on that specific page but not independently hmm [15:30:37] https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/User:JaneBuzJane/sandbox2 [15:31:02] It could be something with the skin? But we don't add newlines anywhere 🤔 [15:31:57] [1/3] Hmm, I think either [15:31:58] [2/3] A) this is a 1.45 issue that I can't repro because my dev environment is 1.43 (what a crime) [15:31:58] [3/3] B) something in DPL is causing this which I suspect is unlikely but I do have a 1.45 install so lemme check [15:33:05] [1/2] got it got it [15:33:06] [2/2] let me see on the page if I can make a table w/o dpl to try and narrow it down [15:36:51] Might be something with DPL? is a table which doesn't use DPL that doesn't have the issue [15:37:01] I guess it could be a combination of both [15:40:34] Hmm, leave this one with me and I'll have a deeper look at how the interaction between the two is happening [15:41:06] :catblush: [15:41:10] thank uuuu!! [15:41:24] I can add my investigation to the issue too, let me do that [15:42:24] What profile decors should I use? [15:49:40] nah, if you use Special:ExpandTemplates you get something like https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/38049 which still has the issue [15:53:35] Huh, because I have a [table which doesn't use DPL]() and I can't reproduce it, contrary to yours, which... also doesn't use DPL but you can reproduce it [15:54:30] And really the only difference is using `{{!}}` to escape all the wikitext syntax [15:54:30] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/Template:! [15:59:52] Dappervolk sounds like a German metal band [16:04:40] https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/User:TheWWRNerdGuy/sandbox?diff=38054&oldid=38049 well this seemed to fix it [16:05:55] https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/User:JaneBuzJane/sandbox2?diff=prev&oldid=38055 issue's disappeared now [16:07:02] MediaWiki parser strikes again [16:07:36] [1/2] a newline \n is being added once the output is returned to the parser for some reason so this one will be a bit harder to debug [16:07:37] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486396143037452358/Screenshot_2026-03-25_at_16.07.07.png?ex=69c559c8&is=69c40848&hm=86bef96bcfc9da8f3402e529618a6702e0f307c0ea62548473b698a2edd197f8& [16:10:27] isnt it literally just dapper people [16:14:43] [1/2] (okay I've figured it out, DPL is fucked basically and inserts a load of `\n` characters, which are caught by the Parser and turned into new lines. From what I can tell it only happens when the location=last because the \n is placed at the front of the table and the parser hoists it outside of the table for some reason, wheras if its placed at the end, the parser seems to j [16:14:43] [2/2] ust ignore it silently [16:15:40] DPL confsues to me no end [16:16:04] Yeah, it needs to stop outputting invalid tables [16:19:09] :catcry: parser and dpl... heck [16:20:45] I wish we had German metal bands for our little dapper avatars onsite, that would be cool [16:21:34] I hate DPL `tablerow` anyway because you can't make table row headers 😭 DPL my beloathed [16:22:00] (vector 2022?) [16:22:32] Thank you all for your help in the investigation! Sorry to uncover bugs (that seem to be more related to DPL than TPT) [16:23:00] I was a software tester for a while and now all software bugs migrate to me 😔 [16:23:28] Something I realized is that the MediaWiki version uses doesn't have a SVG icon for the upload thing on the Editor toolbox [16:23:56] dw! I appreciate you reporting it 😛 [16:24:19] I've done a quick fix for the issue and I'll file a report upstream to see if this can be fixed. [16:24:59] [1/2] a:catjam: h eck yeah [16:24:59] [2/2] Thank you! [16:26:14] Jane must be TPT's number one fan lol [16:27:44] [1/3] :hehe: I love it [16:27:44] [2/3] We get asks from users onsite about tracking stuff a LOT, and the site development is slow, so they don't really focus on tools like that [16:27:45] [3/3] And I want more ppl to utilize the wiki, so I'm like hey... we can track your stuff here 🥺 [16:28:40] Originally I had asked the Fandom devs if it would be possible to implement achievement statistics, like, "Out of 800 people tracking pet hatching, 48% have all pets hatched!" Because I'm nosy lmfao [16:29:49] Eventually I want to make data more structured so it can be used better - recipes unlocked and achievements really need a backend database though, and that's. hmm. that's a lot of work (5k+ recipes to add) [16:30:19] BUT I really like how it intersects with making wikis interactive instead of merely viewable [16:39:35] Is anyone else watching the MW conference live? I've never thought about wikis as a photo album management project but it is a neat idea [16:42:11] I'm considering it, not sure tho [16:42:47] wait so if it's a DPL issue then why is https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/?oldid=38056 messed up? [16:43:50] I was watching part of it but I don't have the time to watch today [16:44:21] hopefully they'll have a vod! [16:44:40] I'd imagine they would [16:46:16] i hope to god that wiki is never made public cause it is ripe with vulnerabilities [16:46:35] otherwise i love the idea [16:47:17] Hmm, maybe its a parser bug when ->recursiveTagParse is called (although Jane's issue was specifically caused by DPL's new lines) [16:47:46] As far as I could tell Jane's bug was caused by an extraneous `|-` [16:48:32] https://dappervolk.miraheze.org/wiki/User:JaneBuzJane/sandbox2?diff=prev&oldid=38055 didn't have the issue and still uses DPL [16:49:09] interesting [16:50:29] 👀 ohhh fascinating! [16:50:37] [1/2] DPL should stop emitting \n in empty cells in any case [16:50:37] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486406967650943036/Screenshot_2026-03-25_at_16.50.32.png?ex=69c563dd&is=69c4125d&hm=e9e41f8220249738d6d78f947baa88119ab9b5d6cf1249af6825160773a21094& [16:51:11] For my own education, is that only a problem when using `tablerow`, or does it happen regardless? [16:51:17] maybe I can remove that patch now then hmmm [16:52:00] https://github.com/Universal-Omega/DynamicPageList4/issues/new/choose [16:52:06] [1/17] ``` [16:52:07] [2/17] {| class="wikitable" id="dpl-repro" [16:52:07] [3/17] ! Name [16:52:07] [4/17] ! Image [16:52:08] [5/17] ! Released [16:52:08] [6/17] {{#DPL: [16:52:08] [7/17] |namespace = [16:52:09] [8/17] |uses = Template:Character [16:52:09] [9/17] |category = [16:52:09] [10/17] |include = {Pet Infobox}:name:image normal:obtained [16:52:09] [11/17] |table = ,- [16:52:10] [12/17] |format = ,,, [16:52:10] [13/17] |ordermethod = sortkey [16:52:11] [14/17] }} [16:52:11] [15/17] |} [16:52:12] [16/17] ``` [16:52:12] [17/17] Results in the same newline characters in the empty cells so I think not [16:52:22] https://giphy.com/gifs/PudgyMemez-pudgy-pudgypenguins-penguins-vEauda2nMdVfLAyXER [16:53:02] (but also i've never really used DPL so that doesn't even output anything in the table lol) [16:54:09] It's so opaque to me but it is unfortunately absolutely invaluable for what I use it for [16:54:18] Do I understand it? no [16:57:53] Does removing the extra line break as WWR suggested fix the issue? if it does I'll drop my patch [16:58:43] [1/2] I wonder, when Bucket comes along do you think that would be a suitable replacement. because this looks really cursed and I imagine this is one of the simpler queries [16:58:43] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486409002811396117/image.png?ex=69c565c2&is=69c41442&hm=a64ea8cabdb234be497c037f711b5a0653b8dc910c7a4ba8983dfaf1bf06535a& [17:01:49] Looks like it does! I guess the table as it existed on Fandom (which I think uses DPL3) needed that but it doesn't on MH. I think it is safe to drop the patch. That is SUCH a strange bug [17:03:05] the least of the cursed things Fandom is doing lol! [17:03:40] [1/2] If I have to learn another data management tool I'm going to cry [17:03:40] [2/2] It's not a no but my brain melts at the thought of trying to manage several different tools at once, Lua and DPL are bad enough [17:04:38] that formatting is kind of cursed but I think the format would be cursed with bucket too [17:04:49] haha fair [17:05:18] If bucket can give me table row headers without massive workarounds then it might be worth it [17:05:24] Bucket's interface is just Lua so it's not really a new thing to learn [17:05:39] Yes! Unfortunately i do not know lua [17:06:08] (Our modules were created by a really great editor from the Fandom discord and I've been surviving by lightly editing new ones since 😂) [17:06:31] Lua's like... on the list of things to learn eventually [17:07:00] I don't really have the patience for programming languages and also, I'm bad at them, so I don't want to do them 😂 but needs must [17:09:26] the amount of joy emojis signals my amount of pain [17:09:47] see I'm on the opposite end, I'm very into programming languages to the point where the BC wiki's data stuff is 100% reliant on Lua and I'd imagine it's really difficult for anyone not on the mod team to update anything [17:11:29] [1/2] Yeah! I've peeked at the BC wiki before (some of the templates) and it was very intimidating (/gen /pos) [17:11:29] [2/2] I like poring over massive modules and outputs though because you can see many different ways of doing things, like I learned a lot from looking at Genshin wiki and Honkai Star Rail wiki (which, tbf, did share admins for a while so are very similar) when we were on Fandom [17:11:31] and I kinda wanna change that because game updates take multiple days to get done atp [17:12:08] game updates my beloathed. we get content updates on the first of the month and it's a solid 4-6 hours of editing 😭 and that is AFTER I automated a few things [17:12:34] I imagine BC updates are much more bulky though because you have gameplay to test and stuff? [17:14:44] This is why we use JavaScript with Scribunto! [17:15:06] Jabunto omg new name [17:15:37] BCJP updates come out about once every month and a half or so, but some of the data gets really technical and they sometimes add new mechanics, which basically means that parts of updates are stalled until I or SweetDonut0 are available [17:16:01] JavaScript AND Scribunto? you're trying to give me nightmares!! [17:16:02] e.g. if we need to add new stages there's like a 5 step process for adding in all the new links [17:16:37] Ooooh so y'all pull in stuff from an external file? [17:16:46] Experimental atp hehe but one day hopefully [17:17:01] and when the filibuster outbreak invasion was added, a single stage, it took me like an hour to update my code and tests to account for it [17:17:16] The benefits being you can use JS everywhere, who tf out here using Lua in 2026 [17:17:48] me with my vibecoded neovim config [17:18:37] Our game recently updated the auction mechanic and it was torture waiting for a three-hour auction to expire so I could confirm the documentation 😭 [17:18:58] the cursor was blinking, I was ready, but the auction was not [17:42:52] mudcon might be clanker propaganda [17:52:30] I got really nervous at that last presentation tbh [17:54:34] "ai or die" is such a stupid take [17:55:30] wmf is not gonna drop 3rd party support either, they'd kinda be fucked without it [17:59:09] I've never understood why I would ask an LLM anything when I could use the search bar and not burn up the atmosphere while I do it 😭 [17:59:31] ease [17:59:36] thinking and learning is harder than asking world destroyer 3000 to do it for you [18:00:07] oh and reading, you forgot reading [18:00:36] I'm trying not to dunk on any one presenter because I know it takes a lot to present about a topic but 😭 [18:06:20] harej is up next :D [18:07:23] HOOTING HOLLERING GO HAREJ [18:08:39] Miraheze pronounciation confirmed [18:08:42] Where [18:08:44] Send video [18:08:52] #minor-announcements has the link! [18:10:00] Not really [18:10:20] That's just... the MediaWiki link [18:10:31] They have the video link for each day on that page :janehuu: [18:12:22] i was ABOUT to ask if mhc was a wikibase thing [18:12:46] https://www.youtube.com/live/_KSXOK_8yT0 [18:13:19] I'm in it [18:13:27] Oh I wasn't sure to post it since the link was unlisted a;ljdf I wasn't trying to be intentionally sidesteppy [18:13:33] Thank u skye! [18:13:57] PetraMagna mentioned [18:14:42] I really like the fact that Harej mentioned the storytelling aspect of MH Communities as well [18:15:04] PetraMagna name drop go cray [18:16:51] https://tenor.com/view/cat-animated-kitty-wow-big-eyes-gif-17482894 [18:17:15] That is really neat to see that there's no custom code, only python and templates [18:17:18] he should show the Bad Apple test [18:18:42] yesssss clap clap clap "engagement is one of the hardest problems for wikis to solve" [18:20:27] [1/2] Is this pfp "created" by AI? [18:20:27] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486429574203183265/Screenshot_20260325-151955.png?ex=69c578eb&is=69c4276b&hm=8896a22c81103457ddef2412c7defe653db1cfcb9e2ca53e0348688adf6398cd& [18:20:50] WikiApiary… [18:21:09] Pretty sure [18:22:06] 200% [18:22:19] the primary organizer is a known AI shill [18:23:03] 👏 [18:23:07] Wiki collaboration yessss [18:23:26] [1/2] Disgusting! [18:23:26] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486430322995363900/image0.webp?ex=69c5799d&is=69c4281d&hm=88c71bdf4a09b6a4f459db45626380156a9321878cbbda08978dd962cf35e277& [18:23:49] lovely jubbly [18:24:15] ew ... [18:24:19] Excellent presentation @wikitideharej !! I really liked the conclusion - engagement and partnership between big wikis and small wikis in an era of decentralized internet is key, and a reminder of why we're all here [18:26:19] YES pure databases don't solve the narrative issue [18:26:26] People want to tell stories alongside their information [18:28:01] every presenter so far has done a really great job of not reading directly off of the slides; you can tell that they really know what they're talking about esp when they answer adhoc questions 😤 [18:28:30] Something I would absolutely fail on doing so LOL [18:29:09] I could only do it if the topic was 80s megamusicals or pet sim games 😂 [18:29:50] Nice job James :barnstar: [18:45:46] https://youtu.be/OUM6XmhViN4?si=J7gHd0V3K6FSaCL9 [22:17:10] [1/2] I have no idea if this DPL offensiveness is intended to break TPT or not but I'm dropping it at your doorstep like a cat with wet leaves 😭 We don't have the new patch for the column shift so it may be related [22:17:10] [2/2] [22:17:48] [1/2] no checkbox [22:17:48] [2/2] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/615786602454581249/1486489305000972411/image.png?ex=69c5b08b&is=69c45f0b&hm=a342cb8fb30b63747b7bc575dfb291ed0652dc2cc0d5e7e8e19325c1cf73841f& [22:18:09] I don't want to write a bug report yet on the off chance that 1) it's fixed by the change you made this morning and 2) it's DPL again [22:18:50]