[00:00:00] banned [00:00:06] thats actually on IRC [00:00:18] the nonbinary wiki should stay [00:00:20] jess: is there anything you can do about these impersonation attacks network side? [00:00:21] Well someone on discord can clean up the miessages here [00:00:36] Yeah, most discord mods can't touch it sadly [00:00:40] 😮 [00:00:52] and being involved in a political campaign means an endorsement of a political candidate [00:00:52] Didn't know that assumed you could still remove the message [00:01:07] now I know [00:01:11] how is 2 messages spamming [00:01:22] you all really just delete anything you dont like [00:01:31] Zppix: oh sure [00:01:41] Well that is the only thing they can do on the discord side, but that wont really stop it, if they are still doing it on IRC [00:01:50] Zppix: let's PM [00:01:56] Ok [00:02:22] Yeah, of course but more timestamped notification that the discord side would need to be cleaned up 🙂 [00:02:28] the hostmask was the same time every time, so I banned the hostmask instead, as they were evading by changing nicks [00:02:40] previously I just banned the nick [00:02:46] That goes to offtopic, feel free to drop all the kpop you want there. [00:02:53] Within reason [00:04:31] This channel should be named #miraheze then [00:04:44] A general channel is subject to all topics and not just miraheze [00:04:52] huh [00:04:52] See channel description [00:05:07] its in the support category.. [00:05:28] F/27 M/29 So. I’ve been dating this guy for 9 months now. He’s taken care of me when I was sick, traveled hours when we were long distance and was extremely sweet, caring and compassionate. But there’s been an issue playing on my mind since the day it happened 3 months ago and I just can’t shake it. We were having sex he grabs me and says [00:05:28] he would really like to be able to lift me up over his shoulders and pick me up to f*ck and if I just lost weight and became more curvy, id be so sexy. Mind you he’s saying this to me mid pump looking me dead in my eyes. I just freeze. Not even sure what to say. [00:05:29] I promptly tell him to get the fuck off me. And we don’t talk for a few weeks or have sex again for a while. He tells he only wants to be with me, but I could be better. [00:05:29] During this time he continuously pursues me. Telling me I’m all he wants etc etc. but I feel like the level of trust dissipated. [00:05:30] For reference I’m 5’5 190ish, more muscular / hourglass. im a mixed girl, and carry the weight evenly, I’m definitely thick, but I’ve always been okay with that. [00:05:30] Am I overreacting to get upset about this from time to time. Even though he’s apologized, I just can’t shake the feeling that he wants better and is settling. [00:05:31] Edit: I’m not asking for unwarranted diet advice, just because you BELIEVE you’re fitter and healthier is great & I’m happy for you, but could really care less. This post isn’t made for you to feel better about your self esteem / bodies on my expense. Find healing ❤️‍🩹 [00:05:31] Edit: I’m doing my best to reply to all comments! Thank you all so much for your responses. And to the wanna be gym bros & pick me girls, no one gives a fuck but I’m glad I gave you a chance to be internet warriors to vent your frustrations. Now 4,000 people know you can’t lift 200 pounds but talk about working out? Sus 😂 [00:05:32] then the channel should be named miraheze.. [00:05:39] um [00:05:57] i- [00:06:11] [00:06:15] Timing out relay. [00:06:24] Looks like they got around the hostmask too 😦 [00:06:31] Let's not engage the impersonator. [00:06:35] anyways... [00:06:49] im so glad that miraheze wont be shutting down or whatever the message said [00:07:04] but i need be more active cause i dont think ive edited it in forever chile <:droidcry:1072716372137758740> [00:07:42] [1/2] agreed [00:07:42] [2/2] deny recognition and let the situation resolve itself [00:08:25] Also, I've had this question for some time: What's going on with Trust & Safety? [00:08:43] Glad to still have you around, I remember how stoked you were when you got your first major template issue fixed, I think it was something w/ infoboxes? [00:10:52] [1/2] deterioration led to major damage from the near-collapse [00:10:52] [2/2] cabinet reshuffle happened [00:10:56] ok so is this meaning that any 501c3 non profit charity can discriminate at will? There likely is a form that allows filing to cause trouble...gender identity was added to the "protected groups" [00:12:03] IRS has oversight over charities and foundations meant for non profit purposes [00:12:13] I would like a source to back up your statements please [00:15:43] since you are demanding a source, is searching it for you [00:16:54] Does slowmode still need to be on? [00:17:55] I believe it's been elected to remain on at 5 seconds as that does force and understandable pause and think in conversation. [00:18:10] still is kind of a pain :p [00:19:07] Yep. Need to be? No. But 5 sec given the heated general chat the last few days though is a pretty minimal burden for lower moderation demands. [00:20:07] All it does is delay everyone's message by 5 seconds? Doesnt that just mean it's just as hectic, but 5 seconds in the future? [00:20:40] The slowmode time can be extended if chat gets especially chaotic [00:20:46] I thought it was like youtube where it only shows a fraction of the total messages so you can keep up [00:21:06] 5 seconds really just mean you need to think before you type. And if you do that, it is extremely rare you would ever need to post twice or more in a 5 second span [00:21:14] It doesn't delay by 5, it prevents another send for 5 seconds [00:21:28] Oooh that makes more sense [00:33:25] [1/5] I will simply state the following [00:33:26] [2/5] - wikipedia notes that only "some" non profits may not be subject to non-discrimination laws [state and federal], didn't specify which are exempt. Religious Churches are exempt to a degree but a massive wikifarm would not have any justifiable reason. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-profit_organization_laws_in_the_U.S [00:33:26] [3/5] - chatgpt specifies the following: ```Under the general principles of US law, organizations recognized as 501(c)(3) charities are required to comply with federal and state laws regarding nondiscrimination. These laws prohibit discrimination based on protected characteristics such as race, color, national origin, sex, disability, and religion.``` [00:33:26] [4/5] current US administration already declared intent to widen scope for discrimination in regards to gender identity, this I should not need to grab a source on [00:33:27] [5/5] as historical precedent, I refer you to the actions of Lois Lerner [00:34:30] As it is the IRS performing oversight, most likely IRS investigates rather than DOJ though either way still subject to it [00:37:07] <.labster> Miraheze will follow all applicable state and federal laws. Can we move on from this? [00:37:55] sure [00:40:37] i don't feel like it [00:40:45] it's a free speech violation, i'm not sure [00:41:03] for a nation that takes "free speech" seriously america is actually very restirctive [00:42:24] also i got a tetanus shot meaning i will not die from getting stabbed by a rusty nail [00:42:26] We take it seriously; hate speech is actually protected by the First Amendment under certain circumstances [00:42:41] according to the supreme court [00:42:48] also "hate speech" refers to threats [00:42:57] not obscene or discriminatory speech [00:43:38] That's also protected [00:44:02] it's weird [00:44:11] i've never seen someone get arrested for something that small [00:45:46] this isn't really a conductive discussion.. [00:46:49] what does "gender identity" mean anyways [00:47:42] going to advise you to use a search engine, not productive in here [00:48:24] hmm [00:48:32] even in america [00:48:39] at least where i live [00:48:52] nobody takes the term "gender identity" seriously [00:49:04] Disagree, but again, not helpful [00:49:20] dont you have grass to touch or something [00:49:34] roast [00:50:37] this is why i like you jess [00:50:55] fucking hailarious [00:51:01] eh [00:51:03] ty [00:51:08] i was just a bit confused [00:51:14] sorry if i offended anyone [00:51:23] 😦 [00:52:36] [1/2] it's ok to not understand things but it's just a bit surprising that you'd know nothing about this topic, given the sociopolitical climate over there. "nobody takes it seriously" is going to feel pretty bad for some people to hear even if you didn't intend to make people feel bad, but given it seems unreasonable for someone to not understand anything about the topic, some people might [00:52:37] [2/2] be on a bit of a defensive hair-trigger [00:52:54] my hometown is very conservative [00:53:05] fair enough! sorry for my bad assumption [00:53:16] it's okay 🙂 [00:53:29] anyways, remember to [[WP:ABF]] [00:53:29] https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/WP:ABF [00:53:30]

[00:54:00] i'd encourage you to be careful when discussing hot-button topics in the future ^^ [00:54:41] mmkay [00:56:42] <.labster> I know I'm not a mod yet but I feel this has gotten pretty off-topic. [00:56:52] tbh you should be [00:57:08] <.labster, replying to !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!> go vote for me then in the election section [00:57:18] According to all known laws of aviation, there is no way a bee should be able to fly. Its wings are too small to get its fat little body off the ground. The bee, of course, flies anyway because bees don't care what humans think is impossible. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Yellow, black. Ooh, black and yellow! Let's shake it up a [00:57:18] little. Barry! Breakfast is ready! Ooming! Hang on a second. Hello? - Barry? - Adam? - Oan you believe this is happening? - I can't. I'll pick you up. Looking sharp. Use the stairs. Your father paid good money for those. Sorry. I'm excited. Here's the graduate. We're very proud of you, son. A perfect report card, all B's. Very proud. Ma! I got a [00:57:19] thing going here. - You got lint on your fuzz. - Ow! That's me! - Wave to us! We'll be in row 118,000. - Bye! Barry, I told you, stop flying in the house! - Hey, Adam. - Hey, Barry. - Is that fuzz gel? - A little. Special day, graduation. Never thought I'd make it. Three days grade school, three days high school. Those were awkward. Three days [00:57:19] college. I'm glad I took a day and hitchhiked around the hive. You did come back different. - Hi, Barry. - Artie, growing a mustache? Looks good. - Hear about Frankie? - Yeah. - You going to the funeral? - No, I'm not going. Everybody knows, sting someone, you die. Don't waste it on a squirrel. Such a hothead. I guess he could have just gotten out [00:57:40] i voted [00:57:57] also stop the spam i know i am chat spam guy but i have abandoned my chat spammy ways [00:58:07] @Discord Moderators more bridge spam [00:58:33] Timing out bridge [00:59:09] who's bridge [00:59:36] The IRC relay bridge bot [01:00:07] oh [01:00:14] ** Warning: if there is any bot in #miraheze which should be exempted from ozone, voice it or contact staffers before it gets caught ** [01:01:03] IRS was k-lined [01:01:21] i've also done some pattern stuff on the back end [01:01:24] (just now) [01:01:24] They cant see ya on discord relay was muted [01:01:52] Should be safe to undo, stuff was done to prevent [01:05:16] Relay is back [01:06:13] cool [01:08:53] What discrimination specifically are you referring to? [01:09:21] Anyone know when wiki creation will resume? Someone just reopened their wiki request, and I can't handle it due to wiki creation being paused [01:14:43] there are folks who literally enjoy hiding under rocks aka ignore the media & society at large, know one that is literally clueless. there are those unaware of even basic safety measures... [01:15:20] what a peaceful life that must be [01:16:47] [1/2] was a point being made earlier during the nsfw discussion and non-binary wiki was mentioned. essentially refusing to host certain topics on discretionary rather than the community has become too unpleasant is ground for non profit getting in trouble [01:16:47] [2/2] its perfectly ok to disallow if you know a topic would trigger unpleasant for all [01:16:59] I imagine so [01:18:07] pretty much everything is triggering to at least one person [01:18:14] yes, that's very true [01:18:20] i know someone irl who gets triggered by the backrooms [01:18:29] will that make me stop running the backrooms wiki? [01:18:31] the overall goal is to avoid flare ups or folks blowing up [01:18:35] no, it won't [01:19:03] I’m confused what you are saying [01:19:38] now we arguing over wiki topics that could trigger someone and whether ig miraheze should host such wikis [01:19:43] basically, banning wikis merely because someone finds them triggering or offensive is a poor guide to policy in my opinion [01:20:13] What would you consider offensive or triggering [01:20:59] I'd say excessively violent/disgusting content intended to shock or disgust users [01:21:39] Like it seems peoples definition is different. I would say a wiki promoting anti lgbtq would be eligible to be banned? Unless it’s just writing history without pushing an anti lgbt addenda [01:21:58] Hmm i guess if miraheze refused service to non-binary people because they are non-binary, itd be discrimination. But preventing them from writing about non-binary things because it impedes miraheze's ability to function is a lot more of a grey area. Although im not a lawyer and barely know what the situation is [01:22:10] [1/2] at this point, it seems the Left gets triggered much more easily vs the right in US per political spectrum... [01:22:10] [2/2] look deeper into actual reason for boycott on bud light and target, disparaging or deeply offending customer base [01:22:28] if miraheze had wikipedia's policy of NPOV it would be pov ironically [01:23:08] i'd say wikis that have no purpose other than offending people is clearly a violation [01:23:16] not sure about the rest [01:24:09] [1/2] not sure I would use the word banned in that example, but you would be legally cleared for refusal to host since that is not covered by non discrimination laws. [01:24:09] [2/2] banning the non-binary wiki not for wiki community misbehavior would potentially be a violation of non-discrimination laws [01:24:14] I think we can move on from this topic, we are beating a dead horse, thanks [01:25:09] we should honestly stop talking about miraheze in general here, we've been talking about it for too long, it's like beating a dead horse [01:25:27] That defeats the entire purpose of this discord [01:25:32] trolololo [01:25:42] I don't think the sarcasm or trolling is helpful [01:26:15] sorry 😦 [01:26:32] people will find something to complain about over what is or is not allowed as a wiki topic to host. some have different levels of tolerance to these things [01:27:50] i have this to keep my future thoughts: https://meta.miraheze.org/wiki/User:Sheep42/Everything_offends_someone [01:30:54] [1/2] I completely understand where you are coming from. a lot of discords and other platform communities simply ban socialpolitical/political/religious/social discussions as to avoid heated arguments that tend to flare up [01:30:55] [2/2] when new terms are seemingly just invented with no stated definition and upon trying to ask gets you screamed at, that makes anyone not likely to wish/bother to even humor whatever said term/concept even is. this has happened quite a lot I have noticed. [01:31:52] The fact that I had to scroll through 45 minutes of back and forth messages with you after multiple volunteers commented on it speaks volumes. Please take a day to cool off. [01:32:48] General reminder to everyone in this chat, there's been a lot of things happening lately and I know a lot of things are going to get heated but some conversations are just generally unhelpful. [01:33:48] might be useful to temporarily just ban or prohibit all policy relevant discussions? especially content or hosting policy [01:34:34] pointing out observations [01:34:40] I mean I didn't even scroll back enough to see what started that conversation. Some of it is useful and I don't really want to enforce any blanket policies or start getting too strict but this chat has very repeatedly gone off the deepend with multiple people. [01:35:47] yeah I get that, I think what set it all off was NSFW in terms of hosting yet again. that seems to trigger argument/heated debate easily from what I have seen [01:36:03] Not blaming anyone and it's honestly kinda nice to be active again but i've been looking at Miraheze more in the last 3 days than I have in the last 3 years but it's kinda sadge moment when every other time I look at this chat it's multiple people repeatedly asking other people to drop a subject and it just keeps going on lol [01:36:03] I think wikis that promote hateful or extreme things should be prohibited outside of a documentation context [01:36:48] without specifying with examples is likely to trigger heated debate [01:36:49] I've been saying this, but I believe it's time for Miraheze to reorient its image [01:37:12] might be best to save that for when the new org is incorporated in the US [I think] [01:37:27] Into what [01:37:36] yeah rn the focus should be on keeping the site alive, not on hypothetical policy chances [01:37:41] Needs expanding! [01:38:04] let not continue with wiki hosting/content policy, its really not productive [01:38:22] Into a more professional sort of program [01:38:37] Which doesn't tolerate illicit, hateful, or extreme content on the wiki [01:38:42] what one considers hateful, another might views as personal opinion [01:38:59] Yeah but that's a quite reductive sentiment [01:39:01] its round and round waste of air [01:39:07] We definitely need expanding volunteers, right now I have 0 useful technical skills but I'm trying to work on gaining some so I can help lift [01:39:18] NDkilla literally just reminded...can we please not [01:39:57] Thats nice! [01:39:57] By that logic, content denying genocides could be allowed because some people deny genocides [01:40:22] A line is drawn in the sand and there's nothing wrong with that [01:40:35] i rly don't think this is the time to talk about that [01:40:59] again, we still need to get the entire fate of Miraheze properly settled [01:41:57] I think it's quite disingenuous to say we should allow clearly hateful or extreme content just because "some people think it's an opinion or ok" [01:42:18] I'm considering to ping NDkilla [01:42:21] Enough I’ve asked for it to stop being dicussed, NDK has asked, and now im asking again [01:42:44] Fine, but this topic will come up again, it can't keep being shafted askde [01:43:19] It will be addressed, but continued circling helps no one now until we're reincorporated [01:43:50] Maybe there should be separate threads for topics related to that, for those who feel like doing circles [01:44:03] That would be pointless [01:44:05] a thread still requires mods to manage it... [01:44:32] Anyone can create a thread [01:44:46] Thats true. I thought maybe a nugget of insight might arise at some point without disrupting main chat [01:44:46] yes and such a thread currently is pointless [01:45:07] Sure but it means this place isn’t getting clogged up [01:45:27] NDK is already annoyed, are you sure about that? [01:57:31] we can discuss that stuff when Miraheze is no longer in a precarious situation [02:05:46] <.labster> [1/2] All I'm going to say is that one of the reasons Miraheze exists is to allow the kinds of speech that are not allowed when you let advertisers decide the content policy of your platform. Academic freedom is one of my core values, and I'm not going to stop an honest debate because someone is annoyed. [02:05:46] <.labster> [2/2] However there is very little value in going over left/right distinctions in American politics here. [02:06:55] We've literally said that? There are just other priorities and we don't need this chat to keep coming back to the same things right now. [02:07:02] Please come back in a few hours 8) [02:10:17] <.labster> I think people are using the new organization as an excuse to reopen every issue. But I'm not interested in substantially changing most of the user-facing policies. I mean, I wrote them! The content policy and terms of service, anyway. I'm not closed to changes, but honestly we'd need to go through RFCs on-wiki anyway. [02:11:05] And no that does not mean open 100 RfCs right now [02:11:12] anyone else unable to upload images on their wiki right now? [02:11:45] nvm, finally worked on the 6th try <:pensive_goldfish:803853749863972914> [02:11:56] 🎉 [02:12:02] <.labster, replying to vhs_> feels bad man. [02:12:39] <.labster> Things like this are why infrastructure is more important than policy. [02:13:01] SDDSDFDS YEAH [02:13:52] <.labster, replying to zppix> Does the RFC counter overflow at 99? [02:14:10] No but i start create protecting at 99 😂 [02:14:51] that's a bad idea as you have told folks they can create up to 99 rfcs before you put a stop to it... [02:14:52] (For those who cant tell im joking) [02:15:08] <.labster> take one down, pass it around ... [02:15:33] Mm beer sounds good to bad im at work [02:15:49] on discord at work? [02:16:02] And irc [02:16:13] I've been on discord a lot at work lately. I check this chat too much. [02:16:35] You need to make up for those years you missed lol [02:16:42] shhh.... <:BanCatMH:766487714262155276> [02:16:47] I've been here the whole time [02:17:01] Office ban 😂 [02:17:07] I've performed more moderator actions in the last 48 hours than I have in the last 2 years [02:17:11] <:SilvThisIsFine:886835684206321664> [02:17:15]