[00:03:02] <wm-bot>	 !log tools.bridgebot <lucaswerkmeister> Double IRC messages to other bridges
[00:03:03] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.bridgebot/SAL
[04:40:17] <Rook>	 !log paws update favicon on hub image T198012 146effd07d2adda41d1c1dc9ff5827fae0012ef4
[04:40:19] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Paws/SAL
[04:40:20] <stashbot>	 T198012: Use customized favicons in PAWS - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T198012
[05:09:56] <Rook>	 !log paws readme for paws-hub 1d125c2b88f1c479eb9e1a9250716b49fd4c1e2d T308949
[05:09:59] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Paws/SAL
[05:09:59] <stashbot>	 T308949: Create paws-hub README.md - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T308949
[07:25:16] <taavi>	 !log tools push updated perl532 images T320824
[07:25:18] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools/SAL
[07:25:19] <stashbot>	 T320824: tf-perl532 missing libbytes-random-secure-perl - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T320824
[09:11:19] <vgutierrez>	 hi team, I'm working on T320930 && T293585 so I need to create two new deployment-cache instances in the deployment-prep project, could I get a temp. increase of the vCPU limit in that project to create them without destroying the previous ones?
[09:11:20] <stashbot>	 T293585: [epic] The SSL certificate for Beta cluster domains fails to properly renew & deploy - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T293585
[09:11:20] <stashbot>	 T320930: deployment-cache instances are missing several major features available in production - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T320930
[09:17:15] <dcaro>	 vgutierrez: can you open a task (following https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/project/view/2880/)? there's some of us online, so we can get it +1'd and the quota increased pretty fast (seems like a non-controversial request too)
[09:17:32] <vgutierrez>	 ack
[09:18:09] <dcaro>	 thanks!
[09:21:22] <vgutierrez>	 dcaro: done: https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T320932
[09:22:30] <dcaro>	 vgutierrez: can you state how many vcps do you need?
[09:22:30] <dcaro>	  
[09:24:21] <vgutierrez>	 weird, that field is missing on the "create new task" template :)
[09:24:25] <vgutierrez>	 dcaro: task updated
[09:27:14] <dcaro>	 oh, it's in the description, but the linked template does not have it xd, let me try to fix it
[09:27:29] <vgutierrez>	 indeed
[09:36:26] <dcaro>	 fixed :),, I already +1'd, should be done soon enough
[09:37:49] <vgutierrez>	 thx
[10:04:31] <Rook>	 !log paws update favicon to paws logo T198012 4019bd87bc9ec588a35944325569177962ccc24d
[10:04:34] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Paws/SAL
[10:04:34] <stashbot>	 T198012: Use customized favicons in PAWS - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T198012
[10:45:44] <wm-bb>	 <MaartenDammers> @andrewbogott any idea why less than half of the maintainers are subscribed to https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T306080 ? People can use MediaWiki or Wikitech to sign in to Phabricator. Looks like you only looked on Wikitech and didn't check MediaWiki
[10:48:58] <wm-bb>	 <MaartenDammers> (I assume you or @bd808 ran that bot to create the tasks)
[11:38:50] <wm-bb>	 <bd808> @MaartenDammers I see many “developer account not linked to Phabricator” notes in that task. We cannot assume that a SUL name which matches a developer account name means that these are the same person.
[11:39:54] <wm-bb>	 <MaartenDammers> Why not? Account hijacking is usually acted on so not really common (re @bd808: @MaartenDammers I see many “developer account not linked to Phabricator” notes in that task. We cannot assume that a SUL name wh...)
[11:40:18] <wm-bb>	 <MaartenDammers> You do have to do some checks, but should be easy with a bot
[14:47:47] <Sariboo>	 Bots seem unstable currently
[14:54:44] <wm-bb>	 <mahir256> this is happening again fyi (re @lucaswerkmeister: ssh toolforge become bridgebot bb.sh restart "'Triple IRC messages to other bridges'")
[14:56:43] <wm-bot>	 !log tools.bridgebot <lucaswerkmeister> Double IRC messages to other bridges
[14:56:45] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.bridgebot/SAL
[14:57:59] <taavi>	 arturo: ^ irc bot issues are still happening.. did you have any ideas why?
[14:58:08] <arturo>	 I have no idea
[14:58:15] <arturo>	 everything I checked the other day was fine
[14:59:31] <arturo>	 I have no other indications of the network malfunctioning, honestly
[14:59:37] <taavi>	 weird :/
[14:59:58] <arturo>	 I would be open to a more in deep debug, but that will take time
[16:27:50] <TheresNoTime>	 passing lazy question; save me looking through phab — toolforge Python3.10, when? :)
[16:28:23] <taavi>	 TheresNoTime: when we have a stable debian version shipping with it, so likely mid 2023
[16:28:29] <bd808>	 ^ that
[16:29:09] * TheresNoTime nods
[16:29:14] <TheresNoTime>	 (ty)
[16:29:34] <Lucas_WMDE>	 (might be Python 3.11 by that time)
[16:29:42] <bd808>	 If you want a thing in Toolforge that is not in Debian Bullseye, chances are good that the answer will be something near "hopefully that's in the next Debian stable release"
[16:33:04] <TheresNoTime>	 Does bullseye not ship with .10? o.O
[16:33:28] <Lucas_WMDE>	 nope, 3.9 https://packages.debian.org/bullseye/python3
[16:33:42] <TheresNoTime>	 *boo* :)
[16:34:07] <Lucas_WMDE>	 didn’t Python 3.10 release after Debian Bullseye? :P
[16:34:22] <TheresNoTime>	 time is an illusion
[16:34:31] <Lucas_WMDE>	 if Python’s on a yearly release schedule now (iirc), and Debian releases roughly every two years, then it should match up that Debian ships every second Python version
[16:35:03] * Lucas_WMDE is excited for Bookworm to ship Python For Workgroups
[16:35:38] <bd808>	 Lucas_WMDE: are you old enough to make that joke? ;)
[16:35:55] <Lucas_WMDE>	 old enough to remember the Linux version of it ;)
[16:36:27] <Lucas_WMDE>	 didn’t they even replace Tux with something else in the boot splash
[16:37:49] <bd808>	 https://www.theregister.com/2013/07/15/linux_for_workgroups/ shows a windows like flag in Tux's hand
[16:38:16] <Lucas_WMDE>	 yeah, that’s what it was
[16:39:01] <Lucas_WMDE>	 and it would show one flag-bearing tux per vcpu or something like that
[16:39:17] <Lucas_WMDE>	 (depending on your boot setup… I was using gentoo at the time iirc)
[16:39:56] <TheresNoTime>	 Lucas_WMDE: I put you down as an Arch user ;P
[16:40:08] <Lucas_WMDE>	 I said “at the time” :P
[16:40:25] <Lucas_WMDE>	 eventually the long compile times lost their charm ;)
[16:40:26] <TheresNoTime>	 but you've not made a point of mentioning that you *are* ;P /s
[16:40:47] <Lucas_WMDE>	 I don’t want to perpetuate the stereotype btw
[16:41:00] <Lucas_WMDE>	 say_the_line_bart.gif
[16:41:05] <TheresNoTime>	 :D
[16:42:59] <TheresNoTime>	 taavi: bad question then; what's stopping us trying out a bullseye + py3.10 install image, See What Breaks(tm)?
[16:44:07] <taavi>	 TheresNoTime: where would you get python 3.10 inside said image?
[16:44:50] <bd808>	 My life as a Linux admin sort of got started by Windows for Workgroups. I got caught installing Winsock and a super early web browser (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cello_(web_browser)>) on a bunch of lab machines at my Uni and my "punishment" was being given the resources to build a Slackware webserver box.
[16:44:58] <TheresNoTime>	 build it from source?
[16:46:33] <taavi>	 I guess you could do that if you were willing to maintain it. Usually we just say that's too much effort for too little gain
[16:46:50] <taavi>	 which fancy 3.10 feature do you want?
[16:48:28] <TheresNoTime>	 admittedly 90% of the reason I'm asking is I had to rewrite something yesterday from `(self, v: SupportsIndex | slice)` union notation to using `(self, v: Union[SupportsIndex, slice])` :)
[16:48:51] <TheresNoTime>	 so very very very minor things :P
[16:48:53] <roy649>	 Back before buster was rolled out to toolforge and I wanted Python 3.7, I built my own.
[16:49:28] <roy649>	 I think it irked the toolforge admins a little, but nobody pushed back in any serious way.
[16:50:02] <roy649>	 It's actually pretty easy to do.  IIRC, it's literally just "make config; make"
[16:50:05] <TheresNoTime>	 oh, you can do that..?
[16:50:09] <taavi>	 TheresNoTime: I suspect that building py3.10, making the webservice .deb work with it and keeping it all up to date takes more time than constantly forgetting that you need to use Union
[16:50:25] <TheresNoTime>	 I wouldn't think tf had all the required make depends'
[16:50:42] <TheresNoTime>	 taavi: you are of course absolutely correct
[16:50:49] <roy649>	 I didn't have any problems with the build.
[16:50:49] <taavi>	 on the grid or on k8s?
[16:51:16] * TheresNoTime picks "because you can" a lot of the time :D
[16:52:03] <TheresNoTime>	 I'm not going to build .10 fwiw
[16:52:10] <roy649>	 I know it's petty, but I'm salivating over the newer flavor f-strings that lets you do {{variable=}}
[16:52:15] <taavi>	 I do that a lot on my personal projects
[16:52:24] <roy649>	 I don't remember if that's 3.9 or 3.10
[16:52:57] <taavi>	 unfortunately Official Toolforge Thing status needs a bit more support that 'random toy project'
[16:53:10] <TheresNoTime>	 {{y}}
[16:53:49] <TheresNoTime>	 I'm here to just stir the pot every now and then :D 
[16:54:32] <bd808>	 I'm not sure I will ever understand wanting to use strict type declarations with a duck typed language (php/python/js)
[16:54:59] <roy649>	 On a slightly related topic, I once got into a minor amount of trouble at a Fortune-500 where I was working because I finally got tired of waiting for IT to roll out their big complicated internal wiki project, so I just took an afternoon and stood up a LAMP stack with MediaWiki.
[16:55:01] <TheresNoTime>	 readability/because you can?
[16:55:02] <TheresNoTime>	 :D
[16:55:02] <bd808>	 the reason I like duck typed languages is because they are not java :)
[16:55:37] <TheresNoTime>	 roy649: the beauty of mediawiki :>
[16:59:57] <roy649>	 I mostly loathe Java.  But, having worked on a humungous shared code base, I do see how the obsession with type bondage, private data, etc, has some advantages.
[17:01:28] <Lucas_WMDE>	 I wouldn’t lump PHP in with Python and JS tbh, because PHP’s types get checked at runtime, whereas nothing stops the JS/Python ones from being wrong
[17:03:39] <roy649>	 I don't do much JS, but I suspect if I ever got into another big front-end project, I would give typescript a try.
[19:31:24] <wm-bot>	 !log tools.lexeme-forms <lucaswerkmeister> deployed b098904d43 (l10n updates: ja, pnb)
[19:31:26] <stashbot>	 Logged the message at https://wikitech.wikimedia.org/wiki/Nova_Resource:Tools.lexeme-forms/SAL
[20:11:35] <wm-bb>	 <harej> Are there any issues with Toolforge and sending emails?
[20:11:39] <wm-bb>	 <harej> (PHP webservices doing so)
[20:16:37] <JJMC89>	 TheresNoTime: re earlier, just use `from __future__ import annotations`
[20:17:39] <wm-bb>	 <jeremy_b> https://t.me/wmcloudirc/44236 (re @harej: Are there any issues with Toolforge and sending emails?)
[20:23:35] <taavi>	 harej: none that we're aware of
[20:34:41] <wm-bb>	 <Samuel> @harej what does issues mean?
[21:11:43] <RhinosF1>	 Wmopbot and stashbot are dead
[21:11:56] <RhinosF1>	 taavi, TheresNoTime: can you restart ^?
[21:13:23] <danilo>	 wmopbot restarts automatically
[21:15:27] <RhinosF1>	 danilo: thanks, maybe only stashbot needs a poke then
[21:15:50] <RhinosF1>	 Although it's been offline 10 minutes
[21:19:10] <danilo>	 wmopbot has two connections, the wmopbot2 connection is hanging for some reason I still don't know, when it goes down the two connections restarts, it can delay some minutes
[21:22:01] <RhinosF1>	 s/stashbot/jouncebot
[22:55:11] <legoktm>	  12:49:28 <roy649> I think it irked the toolforge admins a little, but nobody pushed back in any serious way. <-- I doubt anyone was irked :)
[22:55:32] <legoktm>	 wikibugs used to run on a manually built Python3 alpha version to get access to unreleased asyncio features
[22:55:54] <legoktm>	 lcsb also ran on manually built Python 3, though I don't remember why