[22:57:26] hi legoktm - reviewing the recent +2 nomination for CU I cannot help but wonder if it is not time to bundle ext-CU to Core? [22:57:49] maybe with a config value to have it disabled by default for sites that don't want to use it [22:59:18] Most forums and things have some sort of feature to look up users' ips, so i think its on-par for an expected feature [22:59:18] hi hauskatze :) core already has $wgPutIPinRC, which I think is good enough for the majority of wikis? Most don't need the extra abuse protection stuff that CU comes with IMO [22:59:24] It was denied twice though: T34527 and T37653 [22:59:24] T37653: Merge CheckUser into core - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T37653 [22:59:25] T34527: Merge in CheckUser into core - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T34527 [22:59:39] hmm [22:59:55] Do people know that $wgPutIPinRC exists/how to use it [23:00:07] TIL bawolff :) [23:00:08] Like, the interface is not friendly ;) [23:00:39] there is no interface [23:00:52] if we do want to go down this road I'd think the first step is to bundle it [23:00:58] Which is unfriendliest of interfaces [23:01:00] *the [23:01:23] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Suggestions_for_extensions_to_be_integrated#CheckUser [23:01:27] Anyways, I'd be supportive of bundling, but I don't know about merging [23:02:25] bawolff: is there any difference? [23:02:35] bundling v merging; I'm a bit lost on terminology [23:02:50] lol, that page. Imagine bundling FlaggedRevs with core [23:02:59] bundling includes it in the tarball, which is the default/initial set of extensions for most users [23:03:17] merging would be copying the code and sticking it in the core git repo, so it's no longer an extension, just part of the core software [23:03:32] https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Bundled_extensions_and_skins [23:04:44] bawolff: [ ivy mike explosion.jpg :P ] [23:05:47] My concern is about maintenance. Historically CU hasn't got much love despite being a critical tool, at least for our sites. Having it at least bundled to core would force, perhaps, more maintenance on it [23:06:25] * bawolff would like to join hauskatze in his utopia [23:06:33] don't we all [23:06:48] I know it's wishful thinking [23:07:37] I doubt it would make much difference. Its already on WMF, which is much more a driver than bundling is [23:07:55] and if it does somehow force more maintenance, it's likely at the cost of other things [23:08:16] but I'm optimistic that adding a new maintainer will start to shift the tide and hopefully encourage other people as well :) [23:09:05] Unless the day comes where MWStake fixes release blockers ;) [23:15:49] while we're on the subject, I'm leaving T311331 open for a few more days because of the holiday weekend, so if you haven't commented yet you have a bit of extra time!! [23:15:49] T311331: +2 for Dreamy_Jazz in mediawiki/extensions/CheckUser - https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T311331 [23:16:11] That task brought me here legoktm [23:16:31] :D [23:16:40] more people paying attention to and thinking about CU, it's working! [23:17:25] That moment when stashbot pings you :) [23:18:09] I suspect to be merged with core the CheckUser extension needs a bit of fixing [23:18:32] Certainly I think things like merging cu_log with the logging table would be ideal to do first [23:18:38] if merging into core [23:19:23] There are other issues but due to BEANS I wont discuss them here [23:19:36] Dreamy_Jazz: congrats on what looks to be a succesful req for +2 [23:19:44] Thanks :D [23:20:35] Y'know, back in 2005 CU was called Espionage [23:20:39] There are reasons why its nice to keep them separate - particularly with replicating to toolforge, and simpler to delete [23:20:48] * bawolff did not know that [23:20:55] I like the name much better [23:21:28] A game of Espionage to block the socks [23:23:09] Some wiki history for ya: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/History_of_user_rights#CheckUser [23:24:32] LOL: The name "bureaucrat" was picked "because it sounded unattractive, no one will want to fight over it". [23:24:40] enwiki disagrees [23:25:14] Well at least they tried with the name [23:28:04] lol [23:28:59] I think "the super boring and not worth fighting over user group" doesn't have the same ring [23:31:29] Yeah, thinking "bureaucratic tasks" would be something that'd be unattractive to the average Wikipedia editor was definitely a mistake. [23:32:07] I wonder if that or "clerk" is more boring [23:32:20] for your average power user [23:32:35] or "functionary" [23:32:51] (The main issue there, of course, being that a Wikipedia editor isn't average) [23:32:53] janitor [23:33:01] for admin at least [23:33:25] There is a reason you are handed the mop once you get admin on enwiki [23:33:26] I'm actually quite a fan of that for admins, since it's so much more realistic than what some people seem to think it is