[04:11:52] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> Is using code under the MIT license okay on WF (Apache 2.0)?  https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Z11029?uselang=en&curid=14305&diff=314823&oldid=163430
[07:06:46] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> for further discussion at [[*Wikifunctions:Type proposals/Configuration of ZIDs for given languages]]* (re @Al: Thanks for picking this up. I’m not 100% sure about the “future of all configs”, but it’s certainly something to think about. Fo...)
[08:29:07] <wm-bb>	 <jsamwrites> Possibly, configuration of object ZIDs for given languages ? (re @u99of9: for further discussion at [[Wikifunctions:Type proposals/Configuration of ZIDs for given languages]])
[09:02:22] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> Sure, that's what I mean but it was getting long. (re @jsamwrites: Possibly, configuration of object ZIDs for given languages ?)
[09:02:59] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> but aren't all ZIDs "object ZIDs"? (re @u99of9: Sure, that's what I mean but it was getting long.)
[09:11:17] <wm-bb>	 <jsamwrites> Not sure, I will call function/impl/test also by their ZIDs
[09:30:00] <wm-bb>	 <Al> Fundamentally, yes.
[09:30:00] <wm-bb>	 <Al> The MIT license requires inclusion of the copyright notice and permission notice and (subject to that) re-licensing under Apache 2.0 is permitted. 
[09:30:02] <wm-bb>	 <Al> It is generally felt sufficient to use a fixed url like https://opensource.org/licenses/MIT, rather than the full text.
[09:30:03] <wm-bb>	 <Al> But that is just my understanding, of course! (re @u99of9: Is using code under the MIT license okay on WF (Apache 2.0)?  https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Z11029?uselang=en&curid=14305&d...)
[09:34:22] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> Yes, they are also objects. (re @jsamwrites: Not sure, I will call function/impl/test also by their ZIDs)
[09:49:42] <wm-bb>	 <Al> Indeed… specifically Z2/Persistent object identifiers, that is: Z2K1/id value-strings. It may be convenient to refer to a Z96 object as a “ZID”, but that assumes that the constraint is applied that the Z96K1/ZID value-string is in fact equal to some Z2K1/id value-string. (re @u99of9: but aren't all ZIDs "object ZIDs"?)
[09:54:26] <phschafft>	 https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Wikifunctions:Reserved_ZIDs#Core_types is missing Z96
[09:55:00] <phschafft>	 maybe someone with write access could check and potential update the page?
[10:05:12] <wm-bb>	 <Al> Yes… also Z869, Z6839… need to check against [[Wikifunctions:Reserved_ZIDs/all]] (re @wmtelegram_bot: <phschafft> maybe someone with write access could check and potential update the page?)
[10:07:17] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> To make the system more self-contained and not be relying on external identity for such a core concept such as language. A language might become more or less complicated than Wikidata separates it out. By having it in Wikifunctions the Wikifunctions community can decide exactly what that language means for their own functions, and does not need to discuss and
[10:07:17] <wm-bb>	 negotiate with an ex <clipped message>
[10:07:17] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> ternal community about it. The same reason why Lexemes use Wikidata language objects instead of ISO language codes.
[10:07:18] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> It's a decision with advantages and disadvantages. Advantage: more local control, disadvantage: requires mapping (re @wmtelegram_bot: <phschafft> what I wonder is why for example for the languages new identifiers are used, and not the corresponding wikidata item...)
[10:39:15] <phschafft>	 hm.
[10:39:17] <phschafft>	 I see.
[10:40:17] <phschafft>	 for me it means I need to deal with yet another set of aliases for which the identity definition fails. :(
[10:54:49] <wm-bb>	 <Al> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Abstract_Wikipedia/Representation_of_languages
[10:54:50] <wm-bb>	 <Al> [[ⓜ️Abstract Wikipedia/Representation of languages]] (re @vrandecic: To make the system more self-contained and not be relying on external identity for such a core concept such as language. A langu...)
[11:03:24] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> *Abstract Wikipedia Newsletter 265*
[11:03:24] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> * More engaging error messages
[11:03:26] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> * Recent Changes in the software
[11:03:27] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> * Recording of NLG SIG meeting from 15 September
[11:03:29] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> * Denny at WikiCon 2026 in Regensburg, Germany
[11:03:30] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> * Fresh Functions weekly: 136 new Functions
[11:03:32] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Wikifunctions:Status_updates/2026-09-18
[11:03:33] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> As usual, as a draft before I send it out tomorrow per email and Mastodon
[11:04:08] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> Thank you for keeping me honest! I need to re-read that and see if I am consistent with what I said before 🙂 (re @Al: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Abstract_Wikipedia/Representation_of_languages
[11:04:09] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> [[ⓜ️Abstract Wikipedia/Representation of langua...)
[11:09:15] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> Toby gave a better answer than I could have, from a position of more authority, the community 🙂 I would be more biased than he (re @Sannita: This is a question for @vrandecic :))
[11:11:01] <phschafft>	 thanks Al for sharing that link.
[11:12:26] <phschafft>	 from an outside perspective it feels like a 'not invented here' kind of thing, even within what, again, from an outside perspective, looks like just different rooms on the same floor (wikipedia, wikidata, wikifunctions). \
[11:12:58] <phschafft>	 please consider that at very most feedback. every project is free do things they like.
[11:31:10] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> IANAL, but to the best of my understanding this is permissible, particularly since you the MIT license notice was kept intact (re @u99of9: Is using code under the MIT license okay on WF (Apache 2.0)?  https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Z11029?uselang=en&curid=14305&d...)
[11:32:41] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> The error champion @dvd_ccc27919 has kicked off the new error era at Z28248. We missed you Davide!
[11:33:26] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> ah, I just saw, Al answered already, never mind me
[11:34:02] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> At least you both gave the same answer! (re @vrandecic: ah, I just saw, Al answered already, never mind me)
[11:35:08] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> done (re @wmtelegram_bot: <phschafft> https://www.wikifunctions.org/wiki/Wikifunctions:Reserved_ZIDs#Core_types is missing Z96)
[11:37:01] <phschafft>	 vrandecic: thank you very much! :)
[11:38:50] <wm-bb>	 <vrandecic> done (re @Al: Yes… also Z869, Z6839… need to check against [[Wikifunctions:Reserved_ZIDs/all]])
[11:52:22] <wm-bb>	 <Al> Translators may like to consider 
[11:52:23] <wm-bb>	 <Al> https://www.wikifunctions.org/w/index.php?search=%3A+Z50K3+%22Z1K1+Z50%22+%21%22Z91K1+Z1001%22&title=Special%3ASearch&profile=advanced&fulltext=1&ns0=1
[11:52:24] <wm-bb>	 <Al> [[Special:Search/: Z50K3 "Z1K1 Z50" !"Z91K1 Z1001"]]
[11:52:26] <wm-bb>	 <Al> This search should find Z50 objects that have a Z50K3 but no Z91 for a given language (Z1001, in this case). (re @u99of9: The error champion @dvd_ccc27919 has kicked off the new error era at Z28248. We missed you Davide!)
[12:30:00] <wm-bb>	 <Al> I’m finding the hyperlinks to be non-navigable from the Details pane. Is that just a mobile problem? (re @u99of9: The error champion @dvd_ccc27919 has kicked off the new error era at Z28248. We missed you Davide!)
[12:30:36] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> I haven't tested, let's see.
[12:33:50] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> Ah yes. It's not the hyperlink's problem, it's the fact that it's all inside a box which toggles open/closed for more details on all clicks. (re @Al: I’m finding the hyperlinks to be non-navigable from the Details pane. Is that just a mobile problem?)
[12:57:04] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> I've been getting a lot more "The rendering service is temporarily unavailable. Please, try again later." on AW
[12:58:53] <wm-bb>	 <u99of9> I'm also not really sure what constitutes "trying again" (re @u99of9: I've been getting a lot more "The rendering service is temporarily unavailable. Please, try again later." on AW)